Chicago Show Part Two, JJ Schbetta sent us some photos of the room trading at the show. John said he heard that room trading was off from last year. We have also heard several parties had items stolen including a complete set of the Marx 60mm cavalry in powder blue.
We will not have a report from JJ on the show as he left before the show. Check out part one here.
Chicago Show Part Two Room Trading
Unanswered Questions
We have not heard if John Stengel had his German paratroopers at the show. Also, any information on the AIP new playset.
The foam piece is sold by CTS. It’s a great piece. The Legion side has steps and a small structure with a door built into the piece.
Sad seen item stolen at a toy show.
I’m glad x those who enjoy it if not affected x scumbags…
Same problem 9 years back .Thieves apparently have not lost their (his?)touch.
I do believe Marx character pieces were purloined back then.
Dave Pitman and I were set up from WED afternoon thru the Sunday Show. I did not hear about any theft. I BOUGHT about 35 Canadian powder blue 60 mm Cavalry in a purchase on WED night from Kit Ketchmark’s Big Blowout Sale, and Dave in turn bought a complete “set” of them from ME, but those were the only ones I saw there. Our sales were down, but not due to customer’s not spending….simply for less folks now attending. Those who DID come, were very active buying, trading etc. We got rid of plenty of crap, and bought plenty of treasures for future sales. Lots of joking around, telling exagerated stories, etc. Several new customers this year! Got to meet some folks whom I sold stuff to on Ebay. Good time as usual…Mike Handley
It was reported on Ebay.
The new AIP Mexican Revolution playset was on display in our room along with a one of a kind ” Gladiator” playset based on the movie, We checked in on Wed. and also sold at the Sunday show. As per Mike’s post above, I was also in that room and picked up a gallon bag of figures labeled “CTS Mexicans” $25,00. Nope, instead it had 33 Conte’ Shako and Presidio Hat Mexicans in different colors and 13 O/P Barzso Battle of Churubusco Mexicans. Those powder blues were stolen from our room. I also heard rumors about other thefts [?]
Mike
Did the AIP set have any new figures or just more of their old stuff?
Did Stengel have any of his items?
John Stengel did not have the German paratroopers. He told me he has run the sets but has not put them together. We were only able to attend the show but it was a great time. We are currently in the process of cleaning/trimming/straightening our figures but once we get everything done we can take some pictures of our show finds. Lots of cool stuff and a lot of new production was there. The show seemed very busy from my perspective. It was great talking with many of the vendors and fellow collectors.
John did not have his new figures at the show he said he had 80 sets done and wants to do more due to demand. There were a lot of plastic surprises: Austin miniatures had the new Japanese [ hey cost more because they are cast in resin but their weapons are in metal], their new Pacific Battle playset with separate hand painted base, and a new mini set of three Western figures in resin; the Mexican Bandito and Scout as pictured on their web site and a Cowboy standing firing Winchester, Steve Weston had two new sets of Comanches and Rangers, two new poses each firing behind prone ” dead” horses plus the new mounted Russian Revolution Cavalry figures [ both sets]. The new owners of TSSD had their new Alamo foam pieces delivered late Friday night, the cookhouse and the lunette. Jeff Imel was busy giving TV interviews about his new Women Soldiers figures[ coming out next year] and had a finished prototype of then for display. He has had a mock up art work box of a BMC WW2 ” Tank Battle” playset due at the end of this year. LOD had a ” Santa’s Workshop” playset displayed [ comes with ” snow’! too !
For personal reason and preference I do not like the mix of plastic w metal.let alone resin.
I do not collect it.
Only resin I had are early Barzso and many broke so easy that even after I love their sculpture I had decide sold off most and did.
So unfortunately I will pass on those Austin x sure.
I do not mind prices as is obvious in resin and metal u spend more.
Wish then the best luck .
Most rest looks like recast or same post here before.
I’m glad those attending did like and have fun in the place.
AIP as far I know all is doing is reusing same figures in different colors to cover any era wars as usual.
Different packing,colors or recast of something done is not new to me.
My thoughts.
Best
My opinion would be that the hobby is dead. No matter what you make your figures from.
Dan, I am sorry to hear about your feelings. Are you saying this due to the sales of your figures at Chicago show?
I know some people were disappointed to see your figures in resin instead of plastic. There are others that love resin figures.
Maybe he was discouraged by someone going out of his way to criticize his new products and state he would not buy them. My Mom used to say, “If you can’t say something GOOD; then say NOTHING AT ALL.”
I purchased all the new Austin Marines and Japanese. The sculpts and figures are very good in my opinion. Also appreciate Austin Miniatures donating the grand prize for the “Shop with a Cop” raffle. I understood that all the Japanese that were not in playsets sold out by early Sunday. Please make more Dan And Austin.
The new LOD Amazon’s are also very good and I was able to score several boxes of Atlantic figures at reasonable prices.
While room trading was obviously down, Sunday’s Show was not IMO.
I also picked up both the Marines and (two sets of) Japanese. I would have liked to have gotten the set but just couldn’t swing it. I’m not sure what the objective measure of the health of the hobby is but I can say that it seemed like people at the show were genuinely excited and engaged. There are always some parties that prefer to look rather than buy but I am not one of those collectors. There were a lot of different items for plastic collectors both new and old as well as a few items that I had never personally seen before. It really was great fun. I can understand some people being disappointed that the new Austin figures were in resin rather than plastic as I was at first a little disappointed. That said, they did a phenomenal job with the figures and I happily picked them up anyway. I still plan to take pictures of our finds and send them to Paul if pictures of show finds are welcome. I hope this doesn’t mean that Dan and Austin are walking away from all future production. I wish them and their business well.
Alex
We would be happy for any photos you want to share. Send to pestad@gmail.com
In my opinion only.
I think the hobby is not death as per say but very low and down (or dying) since 2012 and at accelerated way in here, the US. Least in the new produced figures.
Mainly because makers from US now are very few and if doing any are very spread with fewer than any sets/toys.
Is not in the boom as early 90s till 2010 that I consider the second age for plastic toy soldiers’ figures in the 1/35-1/30 scale.
Here in US since 2012 and after. Companies such AIP, Barzso, TSSD, BMC stop producing complete and those few remaining, such Austin, CTS had produced very limited set versus previews years.
I label then as US companies, yet most figures are produced in China and even sculpted there but because the owners and great founder are from here.
While we have others companies and new owners take over most old brands and molds it does not indicate they will do new in the same way as before and with exception of LOD who start very quick producing, not other is in the long run production at full of US.
While I expect the great CONTE start. I imagine will be more cautious in the market and with all his correct rights.
The lack production come after the huge notice by most makers of lack of purchase by collectors within years. Even so few hundred us talking here could want ,desire all to be done in figures .Neither us will buy all at same time nor in huge amount to support such productions of thousand per shot per set every time a set come .Either because we don’t all collect all eras ,hobbies else or because we cannot afford it as too costly and other things take importance over our plastic figures/toys .
As time passed the older generation are passing and others too ill, sick or tired. fresh blood is barely any and x 10 good old generation collector passing there barely 1 new coming in an approximately calculation.
In the other hand Europeans collector are a mid-generation in most versus here .The east countries,Ukraine,Russia,Georgia and few others had discover a profit in it with more enthusiast in Europe than here .Yet they too struggle and many adopted to the short run mold/cast making with more costly figures but limited run and less risk than get stock with thousand overstock without sale x years to come. Till now the high mark figures sales off believe or not as they had increasing demand and several sellers, I chat with tell me they run out often. Least what they say and show in their sets been sold out quickly.
So, the short run does work far better than long run steel mold in this hobby when using plastic.
Here the short run was adopted with resin not plastic by Barzso, but the resin material often become problematic in durability and quality making the figures a bid difficult to sale. There those who like then and others who accept then, but some who does not like then as well and because not plastic they are not targeting all plastic collectors.
Stengel’s junior had tried introducing it with his method using some type plastic-resin but too few and too long-time production delays to sale and do impact in my view.
So far, the new production for us is been supported if not x makers from east Europe and EXF from Asia making more sets than any in history plastic figures so far.
yet the cost per set is affecting collectors too.
While way of life cost increases per year, the salaries and in most cases, retirements are not enough for older generation to cover expenses in many cases compare to the new cost of even long run mold sets such EXF.
For those not able spend so much there some cheap makers with low quality to mid qualities figures set such MARS that can be more accessible to build large armies else and very fast making. Also, most new nice Chinese addition coming since 90s that in some are well done and others crude but can be used.
While x others if want more much quality will go for EXF, CHINTOY, EB and those crazy priced marks brands if want and like then too. Depending in their desire and judgment.
And last the scale issues is another factor.
While some like my self does not get bother with scales; others do care and it become a big stop before deciding buy sets /figures as they like their scale match. A complete understandable fact, yet a big stop/gap that makers cannot accommodate always.
About old figures ,here in US most figures are American figures and Europeans older vintage are sold at very high mark generally .The nostalgic cycle figures collectability is a nice market in the shows but mainly concern older generation that as I say before are diminishing sadly because many passing unfortunately .
So, this add too to the downturn of the hobby in last 7/10 years approx. In my perception.
What I refer above does not mean I’m against any, or anyone. Just my perception as collector, dealer and make myself of few.
My thoughts.
Best
Does anyone know to what dealer the Johnny Ringo figures in the first picture belong? My guess is Rick Eber, but it could be a number of people. Wonder what price the figure is commanding today? He’s one of only a few old Marx figures on my wish list, along with a good Rifleman and the gray trapper with furs.
Austin figures- I order 3-4 building from them but they could not be bothered to make them or post them to me. Guess the hobby is dead to them for a reason. I will never buy their stuff. So many other great figures and products to get.
I will never say to any maker bad things at a show .If i don’t buy their figures because personal like i just dont buy it.Yet in blog i can express my preferences as is a public conversation site .As i stated before.I do not collect metal or resin.I saw the Austin new sets and like their poses and detail,well done ;but unfortunately i reserve my money x plastic only .Resin with cast metal parts are too fragile x me and require much more care,storage else base in my experience. I wish Austin the best and to sale as much they can .
Hobby is small and shrinking ,still there some ways to survive around x long i guess.
to make all happy is impossible.
That is why diversity of likes,colors,preferences and opinion is important to keep .So we got choices .
my thoughts
Anth: There was a small sign on the 4th or 5th floor lobby tables where all the flyers were that someone had a Johnny Ringo figure for sale and they were asking $800.00.
Sorry Anth, I see it was A.J. asking, my bad….
He was in Rick Eber’s room.
As a seller, I thought room trading was high average – feast or famine. The show seemed very crowded – we did fairly well. Keep in mind that we (Father and Son Toys) operate on the 4th floor, which is mostly metal. We are in the big ballroom on Sunday, which is also (not exclusively) a sea of metal dealers.
I thought that there was a lot of enthusiasm for the hobby at the show. It was great to see LOD taking over what was traditionally Ron Barzso’s room, and the same goes for McShaun’s Closet in the TSSD room. Both Ken and David will successfully take the baton handed to them by Ron and Nick.
What I love about room trading is that, in contrast to eBay where you are competing with other buyers who are all offering the seller the highest dollar amount he can get for an item, many (but not all) sellers in room trading will bundle items together as you negotiate the lowest dollar amount. I purchased many great items this way. And the great thing was the seller paid ZERO eBay fees, and I paid ZERO postage fees.
There were many special events for collectors and kids during the weekend, including a very interesting presentation on the real Chicago Fort Dearborn, and its influence on the toy world. This was given by attorney/historian, Marc Gaynes. The Sunday show was presented on WGN, with several “live” cuts.
This show will be remembered as the one where someone tried to imitate the Blues Brothers and drive through the mall across the street.
It is always fun to see the few people who enjoy the new products. The last two years I went to the show I met a bunch of awesome collectors! But Very few collectors at the show even cared about our new sets. They all just wanted old Marx figures from the 60’s. Those who did purchase our new sets loved them and it was really awesome to me to see the enjoyment something we made brought them. We didn’t sell one Playset. My dad spent a lot of time, money and heart to make that Playset available for collectors. It was very disgruntling to have no one show any interest in it. Most of you who complain about the figures being resin have no idea the logistics that go into getting figures produced in China let alone the cost. And even if we get the figures made in plastic, collectors only want to pay $10 a bag. The future for Austin Miniatures is 28mm wargaming Miniatures, 7000 attendees at adepticon(wargaming convention) compared to the 300 at the Chicago show. Me and my father are so very passionate about this hobby. We both grew up with toy soldiers, they are a part of us. We want to continue to live our dream of creating our own soldiers but it has to be a successful endeavor. You will see MANY more sets from us in the future. But they are going to be in the smaller more popular scale. Thank you to everyone who has shown interest in Austin Miniatures, everyone who hates on us is just jealous. That being said, if you want any of our 54mm sets get them now.
Do you have sets of the new Marines and Japanese for sell on your website?
No matter what anyone says Austin Miniatures has made the best foam western town ever, no company has anything like it. We have made the best western cowboy and gunfighter figures. And our marines and Japanese are right up there with the best World War Two figures ever. The sculpting is top notch and our poses are also very cool. Our Marines are full of character. The Navajo code talker has a hook nose and feathers hanging off his helmet. Each cowboy is unique and is his own character. Austin Miniatures has released in my opinion some of the coolest figures ever. Thank you for the kind words A.J.! Guys like you are what make the hobby how awesome it is.
Austin, I’m sorry to hear the playsets didn’t sell as well. I really, really wanted one but I only brought a limited amount of money to the show and couldn’t swing it at $385. I want that terrain piece too and hope to get it either painted or unpainted in the future. The figures you guys made this year were great and are a nice addition to the collection. I would be interested in getting more of the figures if I can.
I WANTED to buy the new Austin figures, as I had bought the previous plastic cowboys and USMC and liked them. And I thought the new Pacific War figures looked very cool, but I, like most collectors, only have so much $$$ in my Hobby Fund, and must make choices how to spend it to get the best bang for my buck. I’m sorry Austin will no longer be making plastic figures in the 2.00 per piece price range; but that is their business choice, and I hope they do well in the 28mm wargaming market.
I was not in Chicago but it seems Austin Miniatures we’re silent about the material the new figures were made of. Only at Chicago was it learned they were resin. I would think many collectors assumed they would be plastic and at a cheaper price than limited run resin cast figures. Also like Erwin noted many collectors have issues with resin such as brittleness, smell, longevity, and price. Maybe resin has improved compared with the early Barzso sets and like Barzso sets will sell despite the resin material it’s just to my opinion Austin through a curveball at collectors attending the show. I do hope they sell out the new resin figures and recoup their investment.
What are “The Playsets”? I assume they are combinations of figures and foam terrain pieces, but I can’t tell exactly from the site: http://www.austinminiatures.com/
Austin Miniatures is a GREAT manufacturer that I encourage people to support.
A.J,
The playset was a new item from Austin Miniatures and included a large painted terrain piece (actually I think it is in a couple pieces with removable bunker roofs), palm trees, two painted amtraks and figures for both sides. It is very neat. I don’t believe they have the sets on their website yet but I could be wrong.
OK, thanks, Alex. Looks like that may be under “Products” (drop down) “Marines Terrain”?
http://austinminiatures.com/products.php?id=6
Once again this forum demonstrates its candid and honest approach to our hobby.
Erwin’s article was brilliant effectively summing up my own opinions of plastic figures and the state of the hobby.
This, the Chicago, has been very interesting reading regarding both the show and the choice of material, resin v plastic v metal for figures on sale.
Mixing resin with white metal has never been a choice for me.
Though all my figures were sold as metal castings I now find myself only interested in plastic.
I have Austin, marine and western castings and wouldn’t, remember my opinion only, say they matched, for sculpting the masterful works from TSSD and Conte.
My Conte WW2 G.I’s just cannot be beat..
Simply love TSSD’s O K coral set and new Vietnam marines and Viet Kong.
Shows can be good or bad but if you misjudge the market financial costs can be dis-heartening.
Remember not everyone, as I found out myself, (anyone want 300 lbs white metal) wants to do a Custers Last Stand.
It’s a pity Austin miniatures found the Chicago show so disappointing but there will be other shows.
But you still have shows which stopped here in Aus around 2003..
Just keep trying.
Sorry for any negatives but we’ve all, sculptors and dealers, been there.
Have a look at what you produce that is selling well and listen to the comments here for some really good advice.
I wish you luck with your endeavours.
Alan
Though I do understand the price of getting the figures done injection molded in China, I do believe that many of the collectors would have accepted the higher price. I myself do not collect resin as in my experience they are extremely brittle. Was really looking forward to picking up your guys’ sets though and would have prob bought 3-5 bags of Japanese :/ as I was planning to, I think it was a bit of a curve ball to collectors to not previously reveal they would be resin and not injection mold like the previous sets but all the same I wish you the best of luck Austin miniatures and hope to see you guys at some of the shows in the future.