Chicago Toy Soldier Show Day Reports looks at the show each day. We are watching various web sites and calling in each day. We had already reporting on the first day, but we are bringing the reports to this site.
Chicago Toy Soldier Show Day Reports Thursday
A special figure of Nick
Our first report is in from the show. Replicants new Set is Revenuers. The set has foot and a mounted pose. The set is in blue or red. Action Casting is there. They have not set up yet so we will have to wait until tomorrow. John Stengel JR told our party that he has Civil War figures non-casualties and Viet Cong. As we get more information we will pass it along.
TSSD has their Vietnam playset on display. I do not know if they have any for sale at the show. Playset looks nice. We will have more details later. It has been confirmed the NVA Troops were computer designed. The figures masters were done 3D. The Americans were done by a sculptor.
Lod Enterprises is there with their new chariots.
The action is slow. It should pick up later today as more rooms open up today.
Chicago Toy Soldier Show Day Reports Thursday
We have gone back to check if any new items appeared. At this time it does not look like anything else has show up. So we have gone back and gotten more information on the items shown so far.
Action Castings is selling a four figure set of Viet Cong casualties and a four figure set of American Casualties. The four figure sets are$14.00. The Viet Cong no-casualties figure set which is 6 to 8 figures sells for $28.00
We got more information on TSSD crashed helicopter. It is about 18 inches long and made of foam. It is against a wall and has a broken rotor. This will be an added piece to the playset.
Ron Barzso had a Duke Stronghold. There have been photos of the Stronghold on various locations including Treefrog. The complete set includes stronghold, small tower and rocky base. The complete set is $260.00.
Checking on the show the action has picked. One of the items at the show is Planet Diego. This set is that TSSD did. It is one of a kind. The set has Star Wars figures, TSSD long coat Germans painted black and Rocks mountains painted. They priced it at $1100.00 and it sold.
Other dealers have rare Marx playsets but we do not have any specifics at this time.
Chicago Toy Soldier Show Day Reports Friday
We have checked again on the show. The crowd are not like before still the people that there are buying. We have heard the new TSSD foam helicopter will sell for $45.00. Rusty Kern of Playset Magazine was going around doing pictures including a mint bag of Andygard Cowboys are very good friend Ed Borris had. We will check with on how the show went on Monday or Tuesday
Thanks for the report! I know the topic of Action Castings’ Vietcong figures have been discussed at length over the past year or two. Will anyone be distributing them outside of the Chicago show?
We will see if they are being wholesale to other dealers or staying with Action Casting only.
Well apparently Stengels pops at some others shows once awile.
Like next largest east coast.
At Hackensack. I see him there all time.His sponsored shows in Queens,NY ussualy in December is another where you will find him.
Note these sets are extremely limited run and best bet is buy at moment.
Thanks for reports, Stad. Can’t wait to see new Replicants set. Nice tribute figure to Lt. Nick!! Wish I was there (with a LOT of MONEY!!)
I have order the Replicants and as soon as I get them in I will photograph them.
Once again thanks are due, Paul – in advance.
I got back home from OTSN Saturday evening, after arriving there Chicago morning. That gave me three full days and two nights there.
1. As always, OTSN was a lot of fun. It continues to be a big show. But there is no denying that the attendance of the buying public is substantially down, even from recent years.
2. There were nearly 150 dealers present this year, but even on Friday morning, Friday evening, and Saturday morning, the big crowds that used to walk the hallways and gather in the dealer rooms were just not there. In the 1980s and 90s, the hotel parking lot was filled from front to rear; this year it was never more than half full all weekend. Roger, the new show owner, seems like a nice, sincere, capable manager who reportedly has several ideas for increasing attendance. But I remain skeptical there is any real solution, given changing demographics and the age-related nature of the hobby. One dealer on Friday night described attendance as “dead”, but I think that’s an exaggeration. There were still lots of collectors going from room to room, with quite a bit of buying and selling. Everything is relative.
3. I was able to fill quite a few toy soldier needs this year, including finding the Captain Gallant Arab mold shot (10 figures) in red-brown I was looking for, from Rick Eber. Rick didn’t seem impressed with my story of acquiring the same 10-piece mold shot at the Michigan Show in metallic silver for $15.00 per figure. He patiently explained why he couldn’t sell them at that price, and I ended up paying $20.00 per figure for all 10 figures. Since Rick was the only dealer that had them available, my choice was either to pay Rick’s price or depart the show without them.
4. Ron Barzso had his new medieval tower at the show, designed by Jim Clouse. It was truly a beautiful work of art, as tall or taller than Conte’s Warlord Tower. I passed on buying it, however, because I found it to be a little too expensive. I have purchased nearly all of Ron’s previous playsets, and I had arrived at this show expecting to purchase this new Tower as well. But I thought the price of the tower itself would likely be between $69.95 – $89.95, with another $29.95 for the rocky base. I had to struggle to hide my surprise when Ron, with Jim Clouse standing there, quoted $169.95 for the tower, with another $59.95 for the rocky base. I have no idea what’s Ron’s costs for the project were, but it was just more than I wanted to pay. There’s no denying it’s an impressive piece. Ron had it set up in the middle of his suite with a vast array of defenders on the battlements and attackers surrounding it.
5. Len Hardt had his impressive “High Noon” diorama set up for viewing. It consisted of all the TSSD painted Western Town buildings combined with all the Austin Miniature Western Town buildings, with a P & P character figure of Marshall Gary Cooper walking down the middle of Main Street all by himself, just like in the movie.
6. I got the three Marx Revolutionary War militiamen riders in light blue I was looking for from Rick Keller’s room. They were the final missing components (except for a few gold cannon balls) for my boxed Revolutionary War Playset I got at Joseph Saine’s last auction. Rick (and his roommate, also a “Rick”) had, among other things, 3 massively wide boxes of loose figures in his room for everyone to dig for, at $1.00 per figure. There were so many thousands of figures to dig through, but at 4 or 5 figures deep I didn’t really have the energy to go through them all, other than a few I picked off the surface.
6. My own roommate had a huge load of Marx, Timmie, MPC, Auburn, Ideal, and Lido vintage plastic for sale. I purchased 2 Thomas Roman chariots with drivers from him, after being inspired by Gregg Liska’s conversions awhile back.
7. TSSD’s new Vietnam War figures, displayed in a large, colorful diorama, lived up to their billing with Nick’s usual attention to artistic sculpting and historical accuracy. They actually show much better in person than in internet photos. I held up buying them because I want the complete boxed playset projected to come out in about a month. But I did get TSSD’s pretty neat add-on formtec base with a painted crashed U.S. helicopter next to a wall, which was already available and which is not going to be included in the actual playset. It’s a very nice piece. I’m really looking forward to the final TSSD Vietnam War playset, so much so that I bought other Vietnam-related things at the show like some Timmee M60 tanks and some 2 and 1/2 ton trucks so I can create a little U.S. Army convoy through some jungle palm trees once I get all the TSSD figures. I also acquired a box each of the MARS Vietcong and U.S. Marines, and well as John Stengel’s new Vietcong figures and casualties, which are truly excellent figures. John seemed to have plenty on hand this time, and mentioned he was distributing at this show the final U.S. Marine sets from those who had ordered last year. I really wasn’t real interested in Vietnam-themed figures when they were first announced, but now that so much Vietnam stuff is suddenly coming out, I find myself getting excited about it.
8. Rusty Kern was there, and I got his new Fort Apache DVD. I may actually make the pages of the next Playset Magazine issue, since Rusty took several cell phone photos of me cheerfully holding up all three of the DVDs I ended up getting.
9. LOD’s excellent new chariot sets were there, of which I got two sets, giving me a total of 4 chariots. Unfortunately, Ken didn’t have the new Trojan Horse which had been spoken of, but assured me that he has Jim Clouse working on it’s design. Ken also said next year he plans on releasing individual character figures of the Heroes of the Trojan War: Hector, Paris, Achilles, Ajax, Ullysses, etc. I was hoping to find some reasonably-priced 70mm Atlantic Greeks to go along with all this new War At Troy stuff that coming out, but didn’t see any Atlantic 70mm figures of any period, at any price. Sometimes that happens, even at OTSN.
10. By arriving on Thursday morning instead of my usual Friday I was able to get into Steve Weston’s room and obtain English Smuggler’s Set #2 before it sold out, as well as some related new “Scarecrow”-themed figures he had (like mounted Sheriff’s men from the same period). Unfortunately, that Replicant medieval monk and nun I wanted a couple of sets of were already sold out by the time I got there.
All in all, as a buyer who wasn’t trying to sell anything, I had the same great experience at OTSN that I always have. I’ll leave it to those who were there as dealers to share their own impressions of this year’s show.
Great report, Don. Thanks for taking the time to write it all out. Have to agree with you that the “crowds” from the ’80s and ’90s are now in their 60s & new “kids” aren’t buying $230 towers nor $20 old figures. I would guess shows will continue to shrink if these prices persist. What were the new red or blue Replicants “revenuer” figures about?
The new Replicant “revenue collectors”, sold by Steve Weston, seem to be from the Walt Disney movie “Scarecrow”, set in England about the time of the American Revolution. They are government officials (2 new mounted and 4 on foot — all in tricorn hats) who are opposing the 2 sets (4 figures each) of English Coast Smugglers. The new English Highwayman figure, with tricorn hat, cape, and brandishing a flintlock pistol in each hand, is from the same period. The highwayman represents Dick Turpin, the famous 18th Century English robber.
These aren’t up on Steve Weston’s site yet, but I assume they will be once Steve and his wife get back to England.
OK, thanks Don. May have just saved some money, because I don’t collect from this era, although I have used the new smugglers as miners and as a lynch mob (guys with torch and lantern) in front of Marx Jailside Town. Have to see pics.
Andy I send you pictures of new Replicants.
Some poses are well suitable x pirates or else, maybe early western -civilian merchant else too
The figure poses with two pistol is been specifically described as (not been Dick Turpin) in PW magazine last edition .
So I do not know if is a mistake as it contradict all posted before.
I did Not make the figure, just read and pass what was post from Peter Cole in PW.
All figures are well done and detailed.
New 4 Normans/Danish poses x Hasting -Normand invasion period are nicer too.
Also a single pose generic death horse was done, but again Replicant is not good with horses and head looks too small x a horse like a horse with pony head.
Best….
Great detail report Don.
It look like walking inside in motion video.
Good observation and point of views.
Thanks a lot!!for taking time in explaining w details.
Thank you Don for giving your insight into the show. I missed getting to the show but cost does not allow me to get out. Hopefully that will change in the new year. Atlantic is getting harder to find especially ancients and western. the Replicant monk and nun set sold out at PW show as well.
Don,
Your report is spot on! As they used to say in the Army.
In regards to attendance, my first year was 2002 and I’ve only missed 2 since. This year I too immediately noticed the Parking lot and the absence of a couple of the old stalwarts. That said, it’s still the biggest and best show around. I enjoy the event very much!
Personally I picked up some miscellaneous ACW pieces from Paragon, Action Castings, Barzo casualties, BMC misc., and another Train at a bargain price.
Ken’s(LOD) chariots are fantastic. Rest assured the Trojan horse is coming. His prototypes for the characters look intriguing but are a work in progress. I also picked up his walls at a good price.
I did have a hard time finding some of the Ex Force ancient sets I was looking for. Not sure why, as they are all in production.
Also picked up another of Erwin’s Jgdpzer IV guns. Still interested to see what you come up with next? How about a M113 ACAV for Vietnam? To go with all those Vietnamese war figures coming out now?
Speaking of, loved the new TSSD marines, even though I am an old army guy. Deanna said they were doing well, but said coincidently Nick probably sold twenty sets over the phone over the same time period at home.
I did pick up one Athena Hoplite to go with the Athena Chariot I’ve had since I was a kid.
Dan at Austin, if your reading this, I’d still like to get your wwII Japanese.
All in all for me I feel fortunate that I live within a reasonable driving distance of the show.
Tom K
PS: Kudos to Mike Kutnick and all his associates for his charitable fund raising and the Playset opening.
The new Replicant sets were four new Battle of Hastings knights and Men Plus two new sets of English Customs and Excise ( Tax) figures in either red or blue: two mounted in two. Different poses and four on foot. Steve informed me that they are suitable for either the F&I war or AWI.
Yes John Jr. Did have plenty of his new ” Action Casting” bagged sets of new Viet Nam War and American casualty ( dead) pose plus a bagged set of ( live) Marines. They look like they are about the same size as TSSD’s new figures.
P. S. I was lucky enough to snag the Replicants Monk and Nun before they sold out.
And for you metal collectors out there: a brand new four figure set made it’s debut from K&C in Hobby Bunker’s room. Matt had a very limited supply of these new sets, they were sold out by Saturday. The label on the box reads ” American Cowboys” but inside, o brother, inside going from rright to left, guess which movie characters these actors portrayed: William Holden, Ernest Borgnine, Warren Oates, and Ben Johnson. Need another hint ? They are going on their last damned, doomed walk together to rescue “Angel”. That’s right, The Wild Bunch was at the Chicago Show! I don’t know how they did it but they are really spitting images of the actors
Mike K
Where can one get the Action Castings Viet Nam figures? Are the Marines they made last year still availiable? Any pictures of them?
BOBBYGMOORE
I asked John that same question. John stated that Toy Soldiers of San Diego and Steve Weston would be handling on-line sales in the future. I picked up all the ACW sets as they look very good.
Tom
Did you ask him at this show about TSSD and Weston carrying them?
Yes, I talked to him on Sunday afternoon.
That’s great to hear as people will be able to order from various sources.
To the best of my knowledge the Marines from last year are no longer available. John Jr. Did have plenty of the new sets at the show. You can call directly, the Marx Man, and order them.
Paragon did come out with their new sets too, they had the Civil War firing poses and the Alamo Mexican regulars without backpacks. Both sets had four poses, the Mexicans have the swivel heads and the heads seem to be less thin that other sets. Upon opening the set as I sit here and type this there is such a slight difference between two of the poses it looks like you only get 3 poses, there is a ever so slight change in the arm position , the feet are exactly the same, there are 12 figures total in a bag. The sculpting is much better than some of the other sets in regards to dimensions. I like them. Stengels Viet Cong are very nice figures and will blend in well with TSSD’s. They are much better than Mars in my opinion. For those of you who guessed TSSD’s Viet Cong were computer generated, you are correct the sculpt were done using 3d printer. They are still nice figures although they don’t appear as animated as the Marines. I find both sets impressive and nicely done
Ed, you and Mike are long-time dealers at OTSN. I know both of you speak to many other dealers comparing notes, sales, opinions, etc. What were your thoughts on sales, number of buyers/non-dealers, comparison of room sales with Sunday show sales, etc.?
Also, I noticed that Francis Turner skipped the show this year. And unless I’m mistaken, Austin Miniatures wasn’t there either.
Everyone I spoke to said traffic and sales were down, I don’t imagine it hurt the big guys much, but most of the smaller guys I spoke to said their sales were down, they did okay, but not as well as they expected. Austin was not there. The thing that bothered me the most as a number of the regulars , not necessarily dealers but just guys that come to hang out and buy some stuff were mentioning it was getting very hard for them to attend the show. A lot of it was due to health issues and advancing in age, the traveling just became harder and harder each year.
The fact so many misfortunes just before and during may affect it.But as they happen right at moment or not to general knowledge.I will blame it to same causes that had been affecting all shows in the past 15 years or so.
Internet and it ramifications.
Such ebay,web stores plus economy and high cost living.
Added to the unfortunate reduccion of collectors because age,passing or health and not near enough second or third generation replacing it.
My thoughts.
Just because show traffic was down doesn’t mean that the hobby is dying.
Shows everywhere are dying.
Why?
Because it’s easier and cheaper to buy online.
Travelling to a show halfway across the country is just not possible for the average collector. I would guess that I’m among the senior citizens of plastic collecting and I’ve never been to the OTSN. It’s just not worth it to me.
Yeah, maybe you got a deal on a playset of some figures, but now add in plane fare, hotel and food bills and see how much you saved.
IF you think that the hobby is dying, try bidding on a rare set or figure on Ebay.
That’s where the money is.
Well, for me going to shows is about 1/2 seeing the cast of characters the other 1/2 is for selling.
I’d guess we got about 10 years before the hobby reaches a serious decline, shows may die out before then though as the are already showing signs of fading away. There’s not a lot of young blood on the plastic side.
Interesting thoughts, Bill.
But many shows are doing quite well. Just not toy soldier shows. Try going to a Comicon Comic Show Convention these days. The lines are a mile long. Attendance is in the thousands. Children, adolescents, young adults, middle-aged men and women, along with old folks are everywhere, up and down the aisles — buying, buying, buying — spending, spending, spending. Or try going to a coin collecting show — you’ll find a similar bustling atmosphere.
It’s the difference between a hobby that’s booming, and one that’s on the wane.
So I think you’re dead wrong when you argue that collectors just don’t go to shows these days because “now we have the internet”.
For booming hobbies (but not dying ones), internet sales are up AND show attendance is up. Show attendance is a measure of public participation and enthusiasm for a hobby. As a hobby’s shows start to decline due to an aging hobby population, internet sales in that hobby will hold up for awhile, but then will inevitably start declining as well.
And I’m sure the owners, executives, and employees of all the defunct toy soldier companies — Marx, Quaker Oats, Ideal, Auburn, MPC, Lido, Beton-Bergen, Elastolin, Timmee, Crescent, Lone Star, Atlantic, Timpo, Jescan, Dulcop, Reamsa — and even W. Britains Ltd., struggling through it’s latest change of ownership and barely hanging on —would really be surprised to hear that toy soldiers and toy soldier playsets are actually widely popular and selling quite well. For some curious unexplained reason they all just seemed to go out of business.
It’s fine to search out the ever-declining number of a few bright spots. But sometimes, in refusing to face the obvious, you’re just into denial, and it becomes akin to putting your head in the sand.
With OTSN, unfortunately, the decline in attendance, isn’t just a one-year phenomenum. It’s become a trend.
Obviously, this has never been a hobby where EVERYONE goes to toy soldier shows, much less traveling all the way to Chicago for OTSN. But by making your attendance at shows strictly a matter of financial calculation (i.e., does the cost of travel outweigh finding bargains, cost of postage, etc.) you have denied yourself one of the great pleasures of the toy soldier hobby: the social interaction and fellowship of like-minded individuals which enriches the enjoyment of a hobby.
So if you don’t live close to Chicago, try one of the other shows closer to where you live — East Coast Show, West Coaster, Gettysburg, West Virginia Marx Convention, Capitol City, Atlanta, Fredericksburg, Charleston, Philadelphia, Indiana, San Antonio. There’s always one reasonably close, and for any toy soldier collector, no matter how solitary a creature he thinks he is, these shows are all fun, fun, fun.
Don.
This time I have to agree with you 100% in all you said.
You are death correct.
Those other toy shows are booming and in fact increasing per years wile specifically toy soldiers shows had been in declined since and slowing down a lot plus many closing in past 10 years along. So in the many brick building stores that carry then as well.
The internet affected this hobby because many of those same bidding and buying off eBay else in the internet are the one not travelling and interacting not more, either because age, time , health or economy.
Action figures, comics and other new generation are the main interested and as you said same way those company long ago not longer producing and some recently- (Italeri,IMEX,HAT,ACTA,CONTE and AIP ),jut to mention some realize it already that is not a top brisk neither good sale online as I’m sure back then when they open their business they did not though in toy soldier show sales first as they barely go to then, they though to sale to hobby stores and toy soldiers dealers who sale to us and in shows mainly
Once interest died down and people stop buying in big quantities to the main retailers ,those retailers are the one slowing down buying bulk wholesale and in the end producer stop as not profit.
I notice a big transition and increase in gamers convention as well shows with 1.32 scale in good interested since mid 2000,specially from AIP who personally told me selling to then direct often in much larger amount that many toy soldiers dealers yeas ago.
The fact that 100 eBay list in a month go top bid do not reflect increase or keep of hobby toy soldiers collectors but rather they staying home rather than go to toy soldiers shows.
eBay comprehend all country plus international.
One item could be bid by 15 or 20 easy .Who can observe or follow if those or many of those are in most cases bidding in same other listing??
Also when referring to bid that are most old vintage items, wile in new production the sales take few first week up, then slow down a lot after.
Limited run production have a win as they run few seat as per said 300 that pretty much go for top collectors buyers around world, but the prices in them are high still as cost or more priced and complicated manufacturing.
I’m second generation and I can count with my fingers those as me.
How many after me you think will come when I’m older!?I look x children in hobby stores before, very few, now barely any hobby stores standing compere before.
How many children at toy soldier shows you see!?
Very few and most are brought by father or in many case grandfathers.
More curiosity than any, after they are gone in one visit a year to this wonder they come back to modern daily world that complete erase what they saw one day in a show.
I had been seen this for years and unfortunately is a reality.
Only way surviving is trying to become part of other hobby or else. But I see it more as an antique collectible in future than else for my generation and those after me.
I see EXF doing 11-12 sets per 6 month, I’m wonder for how long. Not been pessimist just realist base in what had happen and happening.
And I said this with sadness because I wish will not…
even kit hobby stores are closing at huge rate and many kit sites do not sale as before, most reissuing same old 70′-90’s stuff.
Internet,technology,digital,GAME era had taken a huge tall and is not stoppable, that is how future is build .Eras pass and time become the witness.
I’m not saying plain and simple the show is death but yes definitely is slowing down a lot at fast path.
It is not stable, not up ,it not healthy.Is clear .
From 2010 how many of those producing close /shot production for good and ever and those making still are very slow making and in some cases with need of help.
Comic Cons are exception to the rule. Many collectible shows are seeing a decline. The Comic Book shows have many different tracks. The larger ones will have guest of media stars.
Casual observance about high eBay prices – it seems that 2 or 3 bidders will inflate an item by going at it for seven days with frequent “up the ante” bids rather than wait ’til the end with a reasonable single bid. When I see someone bidding two or three times a day, raising his own bid, it’s time for me to delete the auction and wait for others to come out once the high bidders are satiated.
Andy, yes I do same, unfortunately there pairs and even three peoples in same item x scam some times too. It is a very daily issue that eBay with out result had try eliminate but not way to do.
My law, I go in last day ,last moment if had not go over my limited set price I’m wiling.Will be another time if not x me.
Most in plastic appear again, few not common will not .Oh well…
I use other foreign system x international as eBay international had become a nigh mare x sellers with fees and shipping to us.
Another part is in eBay most people are listing now as buy now to avoid the time and get money fast. Those buy now prices in many cases are bellow what you see at shows not counting gas , miles , time else.
So again mentality go for(I rather buy it here seating from my desk that go far and not find it, sold out or more costly.)
EBay had served to no educated or educate certain sellers that go nuts or not depending ,it had increase and in some reduction in prices as I noted before.
Sample-right now there so many Arabs-FFL Marx listed x so low that is insane, those prices even after shipping along are lower than at many shows.
I will not list here the link x not waste time but any one could see it.
Most pictures are crystal clear and tell you the good quality of most.
Most these sellers are hungry x money or just sellers not collectors and in same unfortunate cases wife /else of fellow collectors that do not value then as us and prefer sale then fast low.
It had created a decay in value vintage with exception of very mint items or hard to find.
My thoughts..
best…
“And I’m sure the owners, executives, and employees of all the defunct toy soldier companies — Marx, Quaker Oats, Ideal, Auburn, MPC, Lido, Beton-Bergen, Elastolin, Timmee, Crescent, Lone Star, Atlantic, Timpo, Jescan, Dulcop, Reamsa — and even W. Britains Ltd., struggling through it’s latest change of ownership and barely hanging on —would really be surprised to hear that toy soldiers and toy soldier playsets are actually widely popular and selling quite well. For some curious unexplained reason they all just seemed to go out of business.”
Don, Most of these were out of business when I started in this hobby. Which was the whole point. We were collecting things that were not made anymore. So, I don ‘t see the point of that statement? We were collecting OLD plastic.
As for that argument, many new companies have sprung up. AIP TSSD, CTS and many others to take their place.
Just because people go to conventions like Comic Con means that it’s more a social thing. I’ve seen Erika Reinnaka dressed as a Minute Man at the NJ show, but that’s about it. No costumed characters to mingle with. No autograph sessions with long forgotten actors.
No SpiderMan, Star Trek, Batman or other named celebs to draw people to the show.
Comicon is a “event”, so that’s an unfair comparison.
Probably more to the plastic collector ranks are the model RR people. I go to their shows and they run about the same as toy shows, as far as attendance. Very similar crowds with lots of older guys. Some with kids, but younger kids. Very few teens or mid twenties.
I get that people go to shows to be social. However, social comes at a high price for many of us. And let’s face it. Not everyone has the money or can get the time off to spend 3 or 4 days at a toy show.
My bet would be that it’s 95% white men, many retired or well off (unless you live close by) who are the same people year after year.
I’ve been around a long, long time in this hobby and have been hearing about it’s demise since I started in it. Will it eventually die off? Probably, some day.
Most of the collectors that I started with are still around and none of them go to Chicago. Al Striano, Mark Harris, Tim Steinhoff and myself have about 175 years of collecting experience between us and none of us treks to the OTSN.
Stad…nope
Erwin …nope
For everyone who goes, there are many more who don’t.
Just because show traffic is down, it is NOT an indicator of the hobby in general. It just means that it’s easier and CHEAPER to by something on the ‘net, than it is to travel to Chicago, for most collectors.
Years ago it was different. You had to go to shows to finds things.
Not anymore. Just open your browser.
Another indicator is Playset magazine. Still going strong and producing videos and books. Expanding not contracting…..Bill
I do not go to Chicago lately due to cost or time to travel. Most collectors only go to shows within a few hours of their homes. Chicago is one show to go once in your life time to experience.
One last thing. When we started this hobby, it was about collecting old, out of print playsets and figures. New items were welcomed, but they were never the focus.
Same with re-issues, although there were some really ugly times when unmarked re- issues first hit.
But the hobby was about collection OLD figures. Still is, for me.
The shows were a great meeting of the clans. Especially the NJ show. Guys you talked to on the phone all year, were now right in front of you. It was social.
But now their’s social media and there’s not the same thrill as there used to be.
Collectors stay active and involved through sites like this.
I haven’t been to NJ in about 12 years or so.
If the mood strikes me, I might decide to go.
But if I don’t, I can read about it right here….Bill
I will say there appeared to be more kids at this year’s OTSN then I have seen in the past. In most cases they are not ones to spend very much, maybe a bagged set or a BMC play set. Most of the kids I see don’t appear to be overly thrilled at being there at all. Some kids seemed enthused , will they be the ones to get involved later in life, who can say? I think over the next 5 years more and more shows calling it quits. I found out at OTSN that the Cantigny show packed it in, Nick Albanese gave it up after last years show and handed it off to the administrator and she decided not to have it anymore. I’d be surprised if they had a Michigan show next year. If the Indiana show doesn’t pick up I can see that one going away too.
I agree with all your generation as starter ,as again I’m an odd collector from generation after,but no see many like me around in years.
My history as how I become collector is as rare as can be and one day will share.
Any how…
But yes the collecting toy soldiers(in the plastic arena I’m talking) definitely as You sais Bill come from the nostalgic past and in to the old stuff as back then not reissues or else and barely European last shots were around and not coming here to US by then plus all HK stuff.
But the reissues and new producer starting by Accurate ,CTS,BMC,Barzso did brought a huge revival to a point where I bet would died down if not by then and can not be denied.
I mean how many more years would you be collecting the same old stuff all over?
How many of your nice war dioramas you would had be able to do with the old stuff that never cover many of today produced thanks to Barzso,CTS,Accurate and others after such AIP ,TSSD,CONTE!????
Yes the toy soldier collectors association hobby did start after the death of military plastic playset era of Marx and others but was catapult over and extremely revived by all new producer now long gone-most. With out then by 90’s I doubt many would had bough that much as today, many would had be able make large ALAMO,CIVIL WAR,REVOLUTION WAR,WW2….else dioramas as today thanks to the mass historical and more correct accurate made new plastic toy soldiers production that by now some as CONTE,BARZSO are become collectible because not longer produced.
In the metal the same happen after the death of metal production and transform to plastic ,the metal toy soldiers become extreme collectible and if not by Britain,K&C ,FIGARTI,THOMAS and many others would had died down by now. Of course this is a more priced arena of the hobby…but just saying.
My thoughts..
I like add train shows had died down too a lot.
Toys shows had survived as antique toy show in most and because action figures toy cars dealers come and open table that attract new generation.
Not saying mix toy soldiers with others but tat is how many generic toys shows had manage to keep up and not down a lot as they had mix new generation interest with old.
collecting cars toys is very popular still ,and many children buy then as collectible today. I had visit few regular toy shows and note plenty car toy dealers around .
The shows are way far attended than toy soldiers shows and train shows and youngers are plenty. The few around me in past 15 years had not died down or close, wile 3 toy soldiers shows close down already. One train show also close .
There one Comic convention show near me (Albany) is always pack that actually city has to close few roads for parking and traffic. Is done every spring .
http://toyshow.albanycomicbookshow.com/index.html#header-wrap.
About travelling x me to a toy soldier show now mean 3.5 to 4.5 hours to nears with out traffic or bad weather. Because all near had been close.
I do not do often because my jobs. I did went last to NJ in 2014.I was not impress ,neither most sellers were at all. I notice the walkers and watchers a lot .
I saw many dealers with not happy faces, others did.
Regarding friendship and talking, it was fun , not doubt.
But I did not saw many new rare stuff ,many were repeated or recycled. And all new stuff. Some children but again curios and few asking to buy, not too impress.
My impression and thoughts…
For a booming, growing hobby (but not a declining one), internet sales will be up AND show attendance will be up. This is not only true of ComicCon conventions, but of all comic book selling shows, which are heavily attended, even without the presence of celebrities. It’s also true of a major hobby like coin collecting. It’s what you see in healthy, growing hobbies. It’s what you don’t see in declining hobbies.
Attendance at a hobby’s shows, while certainly not encompassing every person in the hobby, is actually a good measure of public participation and enthusiasm in a hobby.
As a hobby’s show attendance starts to decline, internet sales will hold up for a time, but will inevitably begin to decline as well.
There’s no need to become defensive over this. I recognize as a baby boomer that I grew up in the golden age of plastic toy soldier playsets, and I see that most of my fellow toy soldier enthusiasts come from the very same time period. But inevitably, people from that generation get old and die, and unfortunately the particular interests of my generation in the area of plastic toy soldiers isn’t being picked up by any of the new generations that I can see.
Richard Conte informed other dealers that he can’t make money off plastic figures anymore, and intended to produce only metal sets. Ron Barzso says his playset sales continued to contract, and he got to his last playset releases — Daniel Boone Playset and Battle of Lexington— which he says made no profit at all on, and he hasn’t released a new playset since. New production companies which sprang up in response to the 1980s and 1990s baby boomer revival, and which were primarily aimed at a declining adult market, now have releases which increasingly are fewer and farther between.
Maybe Bill Nevins and Admin are correct — that other than the shows, things in this hobby are rolling along just fine. There are always a few things someone can point to that seem positive (new ventures like ExForce, Paragon, and LOD, all three of which I support, and the continuing contributions of CTS and TSSD, both of which I also gratefully support), but looking objectively at the totality of things all taken together, I am not optimistic.
I personally spend quite a bit of money each year on toy soldiers both at shows AND on the internet. But because of my age, both are coming to an end. And I don’t see anybody on the horizon who will be taking my place in shelling out money for plastic toy soldiers, either new production or vintage.
And it’s why I’m convinced that declining attendance at toy soldier shows is a very real and undeniable symptom of a somewhat dim future for my beloved world of toy soldiers.
Don with respectful observation..
You are not pessimist ,neither optimist.
You Just been objective , practical and realistic about the general situation at the moment.
I love this hobby too and got sad when see what is happen but can not denied the actual and real situation.
When attendances to shows diminished, when producer close and few remaining take longer or delayed to produce it is historical a clear example of bad symptom, not positive.
I see some do not see exact as that, but I understand is their fervor and I admire it but you can not block the sun with a finger.
In the other hand.
I see short production only way to stay afloat in the near future x new productions. Long productions are taken way too long to sale every year.
AIP had this problem even when he offered so low prices and deal per set in the market and much better to wholesalers retailers.
By sample-EXF is very limited in the offer to dealers with less 30% discount to most in large quantities given small margin in profit considering those buying bulk take time (loss sales) in selling and expenses (packing-shipping) when selling plus advertise, trip to shows else general expenses.
On top the sets are few figures and high priced making them not economic new production sets. So that make EXF long production run sets a not fast recovery profit company for any dealers.
In the other hand lets take a close look at Short production.
EB and Pl from Russia, take some times but sale, once sold out are gone. Some sets are still around because not much interest .I had heard some slow sales reports from two sellers I know back in Russia ,but others claim do not bad.
Plubius take longer because more costly for barely 6 figures and the fragile material issue,now resolved.
Look at Casting from Stengels-They sold well quick.
Even Replicants sale fast and once gone with few exception are recast.
Yes they cost more producing so end costing more in sale price x buyers but adjust more to limited amount of actual buyers in the market actually buying.
The Amex-Mexico brand I sale sold well from me several times batch order I had done in some sets, few others not, but had not hurt me invest.
And I’m not a big dealers, not even go to shows and barely advertise myself because lack time else.
So short production had show it self as better suitable for this hobby now than ever
in my opinion …
In the affecting part I like add too…
Space is another killer. How many of us could display most of our collection?. Many have then almost all years in cases and pull to set/play or admire some time.
The more we buy, the less time and space. Unless we all are rich and able to build huge spaces x it we will not enjoy it all. Many already think in it but still get tempted, then end with(where and when I will set them up?)
I had x years try reduce ,still not able ,not even time to go in all cases and choose the goers and those staying ;plus the nostalgic and dreams.
In my case the jobs and family add to it.
So is a lot to add too …
Listen, I’m not saying that the hobby is going great guns. I’m just pointing out that attendance at shows is not the only barometer. I can’t see into the future nor predict it, but I’ve been hearing the same old tired song for ages now. “The hobby is dying” blah, blah, blah.
All hobbies eventually die away. Who cares?
I enjoy it now. Why would I care about what happens after I’m gone?
Want to know another barometer?
Go to flea markets and count the number of vendors selling common crap as “rare Marx figures”. MPC or TimMee mostly.
People who used to throw away plastic figures now think it’s all worth a fortune.
How did that happen?
EBAY.
Which is now the life blood of this hobby.
Not shows.
Shows have been going down in attendance since the internet. People saw they did not need to go to shows and order on line. This situation is effecting many business. Ebay has been off these past two years. Laurie and I enjoy going to the shows. I would like to see something I help started continue after I am gone. I will be here for many more years to come.
Bill.
I’m understanding your point s
And agree with most in your persoective as well.
On eBay your right …
Time will tell us better.
Many vendors selling those cheaps will not sale most.
When they talk back then about hibby down or going down is when exactly most new makers co.e to rescue by 90s.
Now we are in down stream again because of what mention before.
Every body has a wish.
We all wish it last but much better than now I guess.
Hope we can rest in this matter as will not help much talking more
Best….
WOW that last went very insane in spelling, sorry guys.LOL.
That is what happening when typing wile walking. I should get a ticket soon..
If we define the hobby as people collecting the Marx and other figures of their youths in the 50’s to 70’s – of course the hobby is in inevitable demographic decline. If we broaden the definition to toy soldiers more generally, the situation is worrisome. Erwin has brilliantly laid out the challenges faced by toy soldier manufacturers in an era of ever fewer toy outlets and company buyers fixated on bright shineys. That said, I am reasonably optimistic for the future. Little boys, and some girls, have played with toy soldiers for centuries. For most of that time, toy soldiers were mostly limited to the better off kids. Then brilliant entrepreneurs like William Britain and Louis Marx come along and help open up and expand the hobby. Outfits like MPC, TimMee and the ubiquitous Hong Kong cloners do their bit. Kids still like toy soldiers. While definitely crowded by Gameboys, action figures, and other toys, they still find a place on the playroom floor. The junk at Dollar Tree still sells. My mother, an inveterate yard sale and thrift store shopper, tells me that she can only get me bags of soldiers if she hits the places at opening – much later and they are gone. As indicated in the next thread, the Chinese are still occasionally producing respectable toy soldiers. The playsets of today are the buckets of figures and accessories that appear at ToysRUs or Walmart. They aren’t the glories of the old Marx playsets – but for a lot of kids they will do. So while we are indisputably in a trough compared to where we were in the 90’s, and certainly the 60’s, I think the toy soldier still has a future.
I think that today’s toy soldiers are Legos figures and sets. I see them expanding and exploding everywhere. They are still plastic figures. Just different from what we call toy
soldiers.
I see pirate ships, castles and playsets. The flea market vendors do a tremendous business with them. I see 4 or 5 vendors just selling mostly Legos. And they move.
Where we collected Marx figures, these kids will be collecting Legos in a few years.
Lego is highly collectible. The Millennium Falcon MIB is going for $2000.00 plus. The Taj Mahal they did is over a thousand. They are doing a limited edition Ghost Busters (the original)it is $349.99 http://www.toysrus.com/product/index.jsp?productId=75717656&gclid=CImH37OusM8CFYkmhgodIyQEKg&camp=PLAPPCG-_-PID22588556:TRUS&cagpspn=plat_22588556&eESource=CAPLA_DF:75717656:TRUS So it has already started.
Excellent point! Legos are huge – my 11 will set up and play with plastic figures – most recently that Imperial tube of pirates and ninjas – but he LOVES his Legos. Lego figures are a slightly more poseable version of the old ringhand figures.
Yes Bill you are correct it start more in late 80’s to 90’s x kids, Two other companies are strong in Europe and not imported here.
A polish company that had come to US TOY fare and is competing as making very realistic Lego types WW2 sets with tanks and soldiers clearly showing the differences in arms,weapons,uniforms and helmets.
Interesting enough the polish company(COBI) had become news with some issues because the historic thematic they had choose to represent open some old wound, some claim.
All they do is just recreate military history ,is their point.
You can google COBI (not the small series x small kids PLEASE) in eBay and see what they had done
In Spain AIRGAM from 80’s had push hard against LEGO and is strong they had made sets of Napoleonic armies in all countries, entire romans sets and Persians else.
There plenty blogs about it.There old from 80’s are become collectible, not the new series.
Interesting history about this when Jean Hoefler become rename as BIG they start a line of these type figures but LEGO and PLAYMOBIL beat then off ,so they give up.
The large roman and biking ship by BIG are very good compere to playmobil and Lego.
Far superior in detatil,size and realism, I got 3 each.
So yes for historical battle and military armies ,Lego,Playmobil,Airgam,Cobi ARE THE CHILDREN TOYS SOLDIERS of today .
Good point..
Daniel Murphy is, of course, correct: There were toy soldiers being played with long before Louis Marx introduced the injection molding process into their production, thus making inexpensive plastic soldiers available to all children, rather than just the wealthy.
H.G. Wells was famous for enjoying his toy soldiers even into his adult years. I read somewhere that Winston Churchill and Adolph Hitler also liked toy soldiers.
And presumably there will always be little boys, somewhere, who like setting up and playing with toy soldiers.
Unfortunately for the manufacturers of plastic toy soldiers, there just isn’t the same high percentage of such types today as there were in the 1950s and 60s. Now children have computer games and other things which attract their attention instead, and there just isn’t a population anymore that will support the mass market playsets which used to exist. And the 1950’s baby boom generation which revived those same 1950s/1960s playsets in the 1980s and 1990s is now an aging, declining population.
But YES!, by simply “redefining” the “toy soldier hobby” to include Lego and Corbi, we can simultaneously “redefine” the whole issue out of existence. Doing that will allow us to say that toy soldiers are still a mass market item in Toys R Us, Target, Walmart, etc., and VOILA! there’s isn’t really a decline in the market after all! Now we can all feel better about our beloved hobby!
But for some reason, it doesn’t quite feel the same.
Don just hit one out of the park: “2017 Chicago LEGO Toy Soldier Show”!!!
Andy and you shoud go to get more western buildings.LOL.
No really,there LEGO shows already nationwide.
Plus LEGO fair and combentions.
At NYC TOY FAIR.Lego had a lot of tables in each floor representing the ages.In the comics part there were there too.
What surprise me more was amount of LEGO competitors from many other brands ,included COBI and others.
There were dozen of then and very well pack w people.
As Erwin said there Lego show every where. Last year I did a toy show in Maryland. At the same time there was a Lego show, which cost more to get in. They had a crowd of parents.
Don I think what Bill meaned in esense was…
LEGOS are x kids today what toy soldiers were x you guys back then as point of mitary historical interst action toys.
Since 80 it had become strong collectible too.
So as admin pointed out it is already a hobby collectors out there collecting legos in large quantities plus new generations folowing.
The building concept and animation plus colors attract ages from 4 to much older making a large and wider than standard toy soldiers interest.Plus it cover both sex ages interst at same time.So it has a big existences and popularity.
My thoughts.
Best.:-)
Have bought Playmobil Western Gold Mine and retired McLaren’s Gold Mine to display with old Marx Gunsmoke mine front & Trapper & miner figures. The main structures work perfectly (for me), but accessories are too large. Also bought Playmobil sheriff’s office with break away jail wall, but find it too large to display in my curio cabinets. Good news is prices on eBay are very reasonable.
Someone mentioned at OTSN, that the Ninja Turtles are currently a hot item.
That is great Ed.
We may have to get some next time and ask makers do special commando vietnam ninja set.
They had a movie out recently which did not do well. The old items do sell well
Yes I heardt it and was surprised.
In the other hand I was not surprised that new remade of Ben hur was a total disaster and mess plus waste a lot money no yet recovered.
Always wanted a Ninja Turtle Hockey Game, but never bought one. Too late now as my extra funds are allocated toward toy soldiers.
Yeah they were saying the kids that played with Ninja Turtles growing up are now trying to do as we did, get the toys of their youth.
Well I was about that age.
But I do not like them.
I know I’m very rare.
But is true what u said Ed.
Don, If it makes you feel better, then yes the hobby is dying. There is no hope.
Everyone who collects plastic figures is going to die one day.
Feel better?
Actually, Bill, I have never used the word “dying” to describe the hobby; I’ve only said it was “declining”.
When you responded by saying the hobby was actually “expanding”, it just struck me that for some strange reason you are “in denial” about something that to most everyone else seems quite apparent, and has been for a number of years.
Looked up Legos. They’ve been around since 1949. I was born in 1951 & never got into them. Always wanted Marx playsets until I was done with toys. Surprised to learn the company is that old. Some interesting buildings but I would probably go mad trying to build them.
Legos start in 1947 w blocks in.Denmark.funded in 20s
I think.
It did not start show up here,off europe way after 60s as far I had red and heard.
Balsam,US bricks and others were here making strong competition and monopoly.
also had Tinker Toys, Lincoln Logs, and Erector set as a kid. Remember building quarters for Marx AWI troops with logs & bricks.
Correct.So that may be reason they took longer arrive here.
European toys were from early 50 till late 80 most for european consumer.Rarely exported as their factory were recovering and growing after WW2 desvastetion.
By early 90 many had become stronger and compete here .
Wile many US close or move to china .
Interesting Lego history:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lego
I did talk to Rick Eber at OTSN and posed the question as to how much time this hobby has left until it starts seriously falling apart. He thought for a few seconds and said about 10 years. I don’t think it will ever go away totally, but it will fall off dramatically and prices will seriously drop. As more and more of us buy the farm, the market is going to be flooded with collections, suddenly the things that are hard to find now will be common place and the prices will drop off. I predict a decline in new play sets and the hobby turning into like a cottage industry with small runs of new figures, I think we’ve seen the beginning of that already.
Good thought as I mention before.
Short runs production is only way to keep afloat on new products small demand.
About old stuff I agree it had already go down in prices because ebay mostly.
Playset are more x show s because size and so many items are better at first hand view.
Too many around recycling I guess too x too few buyers.
That many had completed their like or else.
My thoughts….
Another factor, along with an increase in supply, will be a decrease in demand. 95% of my personal interest has to do with recreating childhood memories. When we boomers are gone, much different childhood memories will exist to recreate. Hope people are careful not to buy stuff up with hopes of reselling for a fortune & then getting stuck. I have a very good buddy who planned to make a fortune on Ty Beanie Babies. He made some money years ago, but now he still has cases of them filling his 2 car garage (cars sit outside) and utility sheds in his yard. He literally cannot give them away. Curious to see what people with warehouses full of high priced toy soldiers are going to do with them in years to come???????? I hope we’re wrong, and that the hobby flourishes and explodes for years to come, but can’t see that happening from where I sit.
Most toy soldiers collectors storahe end in s a sale z low price by family members else after collectors pass.
There some main dealers doing haul cleaning out there.
Others end at garage sale or fleamarket by third party.
Don, I am hardly “in denial”. Everyone has their opinion. I base mine on the fact that
when shows began to pop up, I knew about 90% of the people in the hobby. Paul will attest to how small a group we were. Nationwide there were a couple of hundred, maybe.
Shows never brought new people into the hobby. The same people attended all the same shows. Go back and look at PFPC and see how many pictures of the same faces at OTSN there are. Year after year, same guys. I once wrote to Tom and told him how tired I was of him wasting 2 pages on the same old faces.
It was the internet and Ebay that really caused things to explode. People that had a casual interest found others of like mind. Forums and chat rooms opened up doors to new collectors. Sites like this began to thrive. Ebay offered products to people who never had access to them before. The internet brought in a whole new wave of collectors. People had a place to share their collections and displays.
So, do I think the hobby is expanding ? Expanding ……No.
Holding it’s own, is probably right.
I don’t know what Rusty’s subscription list is, but I bet it bigger that PFPC’s was.
And he has expanded into video’s and books.
Did any of us really imagine that he could sit at home and watch a video about Marx playsets? I would call that growth.
I can tell you that there are a hundred times the people involved today than there was back when I started.
Back then, the only new figure maker to come along was Accurate.
That’s all. Just one.
How many are there today?
I can name at least ten.
So that’s expansion, again.
As for Rick Eber, that’s his opinion. Seems to me he has the most to lose, yet his prices don’t reflect that now, do they?
10 years, 20 years, what’s the difference? It certainly isn’t imminent.
People that think that they are going to get rich investing in figures and playsets are insane. Beanie Babies, Baseball Cards, Comic Books, Star Wars and on and on all fell victim to the classic pump and dump schemes of a few. Prices were artificially pumped up and when they hit their peak, those in the know got out and got rich. The suckers got stuck with worthless junk.
Just like this hobby. I see people dumping Arabs all over Ebay now. Why? The re issues will kill the price. Time to get out.
Remember when a Falling Horse and Rider cost 200 bucks? Now they can’t bring 50 bucks.
What would happen if the Gunsmoke or Ringo mold turned up?
All those “investors” would take a beating.
My take is that this is a fun hobby. I like the hunt for the odd piece. I like converting.
I don’t care that I’ve damaged a perfectly good figure.
I would NEVER pay 20 dollars each for a plastic figure. I’ll wait until I run across them some day.
But that’s just me. To others, it’s worth it. Nothing wrong with that. But to buy them thinking that the value is going to increase, is not the way I collect.
Bill, you’ve finally said a few things I can agree with.
Totally agree with Bill, actually saved me time on what would have been a rather long post. Yes, many of us “boomers” are dying off – sadly; and perhaps there won’t be as many from younger generations to take our place but, as another has said – what do I care if I’m not here?
I’ve said before I realized a looooong time ago my “investment” value of my collection was very limited the moment I decided I was going to enjoy my collection instead of hoarding it. I plan to leave detailed instructions for how my family can get the most out of my toys when I’m gone, but I don’t think for a moment my wife will be able to live off it. But I had fun with the little guys.
As far as shows go – I don’t think there’s anyone who can say I’m not actively involved in the hobby, but the only show I’ve ever been able to make so far is San Antonio and for years that was touch and go because it interfered with my end-of-year duties as chair of my high school’s history department (I had to be at EVERY graduation, which usually fell on Memorial Day weekend, too) – even since I retired we have only managed every other year. It’s just expensive to travel all the way out there and back – not to mention the spouse getting time off. But we go because we love the people, the show and – San Antonio.
I would love to make ONE Chicago show, if only to be able to say I’ve been but even though I was born and spent my younger childhood in lower Illinois (across the River from St Louis) I really can’t get too excited about visiting Chicago. But I hope to go again – at least once, if only to meet those hobby buddies that can’t make it to San Antonio (for much the same reasons I haven’t made it to Chicago).
If attendance at shows was the only barometer for the health of the hobby we might be in trouble, but Bill has done a great job of detailing other signs of at least stability in the overall health of the hobby. Heck, it’s probably doing better healthwise than many of us are. (LOL)
Boy, I’m sadly disappointed in the total lack of any photodocumentation of the plastic offerings at OTSN this year. No pictures of TSSD’s Vietnam playset set up, no pictures of Marx Man Vietnam figures, no pictures or even what playset was opened. The metal collectors are sure up on us plastic collectors in that arena.
Clouse who did photos before back off claiming it did not give time to enjoy the show. He may have some photos later. Rusty Kern did photos for the magazine so they will be later. I am checking sources for any photos. I will be doing photos for Hackensack.
I saw in facebook some few were it depict the viet nam figures.most are closeup.
All I did was type
Chicago toy soldier show 2016
I can understand Jim’s reluctance to take pix. I’ve done a couple reports before on the San Antonio Show – it wasn’t much of a hassle for me as in my mind I was just sharing pix I’d taken at the time for those who couldn’t make it. Then I started getting PMs about stuff I had no idea of and really wasn’t interested in. I had one guy who was upset because I didn’t mention certain tables that were there. I honestly didn’t think about it and there was no offense meant. I’m not saying if we make it to another show I won’t share my pix and comments – but I hope to make pretty danged sure I put a BIG disclaimer on anything I post.
As they say, “No good deed goes unpunished…”
I don’t mine doing photos as I like to share it with the people who can not attend the show. I have not had anyone get upset of not showing their table. My reply would be did you take a photo we can share? It is hard sometimes as some people do not want their photo taken for various reasons.
The only one I saw taking pictures was Rusty, a few others were taking random pictures with their cell phones.
I enjoy photos, too. Even if I was at the show itself, it’s still fun to re-live the whole experience.
But I can understand Jim Clouse’s point. Everyone enjoys the photos, but the person going around taking photos experiences an interruption of his own .
I found the same thing years ago when I wanted to write a show report for Stad’s old print publication. I knew I couldn’t remember everything when I got home, so I tried taking notes in each room, to avoid forgetting interesting details when I sat down to write the report.
That approach ended up being way too burdensome. It curtailed my own enjoyment of looking at toy soldiers and moving quickly from dealer to dealer. So I gave it up, just enjoyed the show, and wrote the report just relying on my memory when I got home.
But show photos of the dealers, collectors, tables, and toy soldiers are always appreciated, if someone can be persuaded to go to the trouble.
For those who are interested, I just received an email (in response to my own inquiry on the Classic Toy Soldier (CTS) website) from David Payne, confirming that the North Koreans have definitely shipped from China, and are expected to be in CTS’ hands mid to late October.
I had very much hoped to see them at OTSN, and bring them straight home with me.
I thought the CTS Chinese Communists were excellent figures, and the partial photos of the North Korean set look equally good. I hope when they arrive people don’t nitpick them to death.
Thank you Don x heads up.
Most CTS are not the super sculpture.Yet some sets had come very well done versus others and match with many other top brand.
I had skipped the last CTS sets but I will buy both as this forgotten war has been revived only by CTS as only AURBURN vintage GIs were real made era korea soldiers.
The weapons and gear of chinese are very accurate done.
So definitely my choice buy and I will like few,seats each as in this case numbers are needed.
For now I will use some WW2 and WINTER TSSD x American s w some vintage till one day are done.
Thanks for the info. I look very much forward to getting these. It is a war that I have wanted someone to do for a long time and I am glad that CTS are doing it. The Chinese looked great.
Any news as to when we might see the Korean War Marines, ROK’s, and G.I.’s?
BOBBYGMOORE
Getting back to the Chicago show – yes it’s not the same as it was 20 years ago, but for the collector who has never been, it still blows you away. I too remember the “glory days,” of OTSN, yet for some collectors THESE are the glory days – it’s all relative. I have enjoyed buying and selling on the internet and I believe that it has expanded the hobby in many ways – mostly good ways. I’m not saying that one has replaced the other – because they are two different breeds of the same species. One has become more popular and convenient. Internet usually (but not always) involves bidding, the show involves bargaining. Except for “buy-it-now” ebay evokes the highest price you will pay – by contrast, the show is about getting there first or finding something everyone missed, and then trying to pay the lowest price possible. Yes, some sellers do not negotiate, but most do if you have the right attitude. I can’t begin to tell you the great stuff I came home with – handfuls of Marx figures for less than a buck, Timmee and Werner figures for the same, and yes, Conte Normans in a 25 cent bin. I bought a repop Marx wagon with all the accessories for 5$ and a litho Western storefront for 50$. I love to collect Marx steers, especially the two “skinny” poses – I picked out five beautiful flat plastic steers, talked with the vendor for awhile about Marx stuff, gave him the exact total he was asking, and he gave me back some of my money – the steers ended up costing only 3 bucks apiece. I love the internet, but that’s the fun of doing business at the show. The hobby is not dying for THIS boy – changing in ways, yes. But next year, Lord willing, my adrenaline will start pumping on Wednesday when I see the facade of the Hyatt, and won’t stop until Sunday afternoon.
We are having photos from a French collector coming up. it was his first time. He said the show was amazing.
I think I had more fun when I just used to go to buy and hang out, this dealer stuff takes away from the fun. I don’t get to wander much , when I do get out of the room it’s to take a smoke break. Of course I do get to BS with the the other smokers.
Yes, Ed, I’ve noticed I have more fun when I can wander from room to room without being tied down to my own trying to sell things. But, of course, if no dealer sat in his room there wouldn’t be anyone for the buyers like me to visit. So we appreciate your efforts, as well as those of all the other dealers who patiently confine themselves (at least for much of the weekend) to their rooms.
I have to admit I have more fun and relax if I am not behind a table.
Paul, I can remember when I first met you face to face, after several phone conversations, sitting in your room at OTSN.
Yeah, selling makes the show tense, you wonder if you are going to sell enough to meet expenses. You almost hate to go to lunch or supper because while your gone you could miss that big sale. It sure was easier being a buyer, no packing and unpacking, then packing again to unpack and finally packing up again to go home and unpack yet again. Yikes that gets old quick. I guess it doesn’t help that I am getting older and less robust either.
You said it, Ed – that’s the downside – just ask my wife, bless her heart.
New Replicants photos & prices up on Steve Weston’s site.
Also has some of Stengel Jr.’s figures available under “new stock”‘.
Prices are good & shipping not much more than domestic.
http://plasticsoldiers.co.uk/index.php/manufacturer/replicants/
Yes Stengels 4 figures x$7.00 not counting shipping!!!
Not way, not x me. Sorry.
At the show, Stengel’s six (6) different Viet Cong non-casualty figures were priced at $28.00.
The five (5) Viet Cong casualty figures were priced at $14.00.
The five (5) U.S. Marine casualty figures were also priced at $14.00.
Sort of high, but no different than Replicant figures. Unfortunately, as new production in this hobby becomes aimed primarily at adults (as opposed to children) things become more expensive.
What was said of Pvblivs and Engineer Bassevitch is also true of Stengel: He is aiming more at serious adult collectors who feel they have to have the limited editions he makes, rather than at some mass market.
Unfortunately.I have to disagree and agree with you as …
I do not know what price you saw ,got or else!. But thank you for your past observation that many I bet had miss ,still high x me.
Unfortunately .Stengels won’t be at every single shows and Chicago shows is once a year.
Unfortunately his figures are very limited run=done.
Unfortunately he does not sale in any store, web site, eBay or else with those prices and for very long those wanting his figures have to play hide and sick to get then x very long x wherever reason it may be .
Unfortunately those prices you saw are not reflected in the price I just saw in SW site.
Unfortunately I know already this hobby is not for children but for adults long long ago and any kid asking dad buy these pricey figures will get a BIG NO right away.
Any way I do not see many kids asking x our hobby toy soldiers, playing with neither been aware what so ever we ever exist at all.
Unfortunately I can not support those prices because I considered it a ROB in my personal opinion and budgeted mentality.
Same I said about PLUBIUS and other .
Unfortunately if makers follow this treat then the hobby will be unfortunately more limited and less buyers able to spend more.
Unfortunately this means as above that any one trying make limited run figures like per said in other country could have then made for few pesos and resale for 7 to 10 times the cost and it will benefits a lot makers and few resellers not collectors at all.
Unfortunately the price I see above link show at actual conversion is…
The ST 4 figures death of Viet Nam war are at $23.36 USD exact =$5.84 per figure not counting shipping added from UK.
CW General pose x $10.38 USD not counting shipping
But REPLICANTS are $1.95 USD each foot pose!!!!!!.Not near at all those others!!!
A big difference from others above ,even at US show price you saw in CHICAGO. OF
Stengels sets were as you wrote …
6 figures X $28.00 =$4.60 USD
or 5 casualties at $14.00 =$2.80
Russia expensive limited run sets are
EB $3-5.00 each aprox,depending set
Plubius $8.33 USD per figure ,not counting shipping
Unfortunately Stengels looking at the show price you mention and my lay out base in actual price from sellers/makers are actually very close even to Plubius and above Engineer Bassevitch ;pretty much making then top $$$$ for few out there and I bet many will said NO.
Sorry I do not support it at all!!
My thoughs,my points, my preference, my like, my money.
best regards.
As usual, Erwin, I find myself in agreement with almost all of your toy-soldier related observations.
But I think Mr. Weston has put a mark-up on Stengel’s Action Casting sets, and will then see if anyone wants them bad enough to pay the price.
John Jr. made the comment at OTSN he was confident he had more than enough of his new Viet Cong figures that so everyone who wanted a set would have one available. He seemed confident he had worked out his previous production process issues.
But, yes, money is not unlimited. And at those prices I can afford one, and maybe two, of his sets of four Confederate marchers. With the interchangeable heads and other parts, then two sets would give me eight new Confederate marching poses, all sculpted in size and appearance to match the Conte plastic Confederates.
And just to show how completely honest John Jr. is, I should add that, as he put it, to make up for the delay he experienced in getting me his first set of Vietnam U.S. Marines last year, he GAVE me at OTSN a boxed set of his 3-figure “Hancock At Gettysburg” set. He mentioned he had tried to make up to everyone who had to wait for their sets last year, by giving each of them something to compensate for the wait.
Believe me, there’s a reason everybody in this hobby has always liked and respected the Stengels.
Yeah me and Mike got sets too of Hancock. I even got a prototype zombie figure which he wants to do in the future. He says if Zombies sell well he’s even going to make a figure of me called South Bend Eddie a zombie killer, that’s what Stengel Senior used to call me. Yes, he knew I was from Chicago.
I do have good faith in Stengeld past father.
I had met his son and is very good in direct business hand to hand.
I had done so in person w him before.
But I Was reffering regarding his figures priced as been scarry priced to put some out there in the inflation idea.
I do not want and I have to regret not buying his.
As I like him like enthusiastic good man.
About his sales.He need improve his relation and way to offer this figures in a way could be sale direct by mail in US.
I wish I can support all but looking at furture with skeptisism.
Lets not forget than before Conte figures in long production were at more modic price.
Now long run mass prooduced are from 1.45 to 3.33 per.
Thanks to Conte start the price increase.
I know life change and get costly.
But going back to short run Coles Replicant figures had been in market x over 20 years and prices have stayed around same.Very correct to me.Still they sale like hot dog.
and fast.
I hope Stengles do good and wish best.I will tell himso in person when see .
Hope all he mention to you Don is true and if premised be accomplished.
Best regards.
If I may.
John Sr was a collector first. That’s what drew him in. By trade, he was an accountant.
I know that he left his accounting job to go full time into the hobby business.
But, he was always a collector first. That was his mindset.
I know John Jr since he was 8 or 9, and yet I have no idea if he even collects figures or not. Jr. grew up in the BUSINESS. To him, it’s his business and livelihood.
It has always been business first.
Way different mindsets.
John Jr.’s passion is sculpting, making new products and mastering cold resin/plastic figure pours. Not dealing in old plastic.
Selling the latest releases pays the bills and allows him to keep going with what he really wants to do. Which is to produce his own line of figures.
Prices are what the market will allow.
I wouldn’t pay that price, but that’s an individual choice.
I’m sure he will do fine, as Nam seems to be the new “thing”.
I think he collect more his age toy era ,pretty much mine ,but I do not collect my childhood toy era. I collect my dads toy era and those before plus any new in this hobby.No gi’s joes,action figure ,star wars action…
He mention it to me and at shows several time swap or bough to me few of those I had carry in past. I bough from his dad most and with him pretty much talk a lot ,he is very fun guy with billion of ideas. I had seem him since 90’s and as you said Bill, he is very cool negotiating ,no way you can access his table at any show and get something from him, he always play a better deal if you want something others have .
I wish him the best in all, just I do not buy that price and it scary me regarding what could be x others mine set. That is all.
Last time I saw him in person at Hackensack he ask me few question regarding OWN and my tank ,we share some info.. and thoughts about his production and mine ,that was it. Never talk about prices.
Again I wish him best; but would be set better if set a mail/store-eBay else ,not at shows only I suggest.
If figures are not that heavy a good suggestion-incentive is set free shipping in orders up two set that will fit in bubble bag(15 X11X4) if less 13 oz and cost not more $5.00 If inside United States continental. If over that amount give discount in shipping.
I had done so and attract more. It may cost a bit but increase the tempting of buying as is an incentive.
Any one see him before me may suggest it if not mine I will think.
If he need better info to where get these bags very cheap and good x shipping have him contact me.
I try help as much I can others even if not agree with.
I collect, support and sale.
My thoughts.
And yes Bill ,Nam is the new hit and it touch a good moment x sales I guess.
You are right!!
I will go in to it as I collect ALL eras and I been waiting years x it to come only TM and HK RADO Rambo rare figures only made ,or only odd conversion were available unless plastic 1.35 kits .
Ironical there is plenty armor/vehicles and (houses bough in Viet Nam indeed) in my collection from many foreign makers and soon I will set my Viet Nam war scenes to play with my daughter and will share it.
I wish my dog could play but last time I try was a mistake.LOL
I have bought all of his figures so far because I consider him a friend as I did his dad. They always helped me and I helped them any way I could. His dad for some reason loved steers, he’d see he’d buy them, he was never sure why, he just liked them. I once sold Senior $1,000.00 worth of loose figures at Indy on a promise he’d pay me at OTSN. Sure enough when OTSN came around it wasn’t 15 minutes since I arrived when I ran into him and he paid me. I’ve spent many hours talking to both of them and it was always a good time.
John Sr was into sculpting, too. When I would visit, we would hang for hours discussing conversions, new poses or things we could improve on. He got frustrated by trying to attach plastic parts and decide to try his hand at sculpting. He got to be pretty good at it.
He did the prototype for the 1/72 IMEX firing platform. He was also a good terrain maker and had a thing for Britain’s trees. I remember his first piece was a tree stump!
But, what I’ll always remember was the framed front cover of some magazine (People?) that had Nick Nolte, as the worlds sexiest man.
It was always on his desk. I think Irene had given it to him as a joke.
That’s how I want to remember him.